are ebay big turbos actually shite?

seatcupramad23

kc4even23
Sep 7, 2009
3,239
2
birmingham
question is in the past 6 months i've been seeing more and more turbo set ups using ebay turbos from toyosprot t3/4 type .50 a/r with great results and lasting for years without issue . interesting debate because my opinion is change i don't why i should buy a garrett turbo £1200-1500 when for ten times less can buy a turbo which will give similar figures and from recent evidence last just as long. no doubt the majority will tell me that they are chinese crap that are built very cheap with cheap materials but i'm just going by what i've seen ,

mk3 ibiza runnning this set up for ages on low boost because on stock internals 300bhp 260 ft/lbs 12psi

mk4 golf drag car abused hard for 4 years with NOS 400bhp and 480 with nos and still running strong

mk2 escort running £150 turbo for over 4 years also running 557bhp and 480ft/lbs .


i've seen big gt28/30 fail after months . i'm interesting to here every opinions and views
 

westallc

Active Member
Jan 25, 2009
132
0
at first it wa said there all rubarb but after seeing some of the cars running these and how there abused and running big power and still going strong after so long it does make you wonder if its really worth spending 10x more on garret etc etc
 

seatcupramad23

kc4even23
Sep 7, 2009
3,239
2
birmingham
at first it wa said there all rubarb but after seeing some of the cars running these and how there abused and running big power and still going strong after so long it does make you wonder if its really worth spending 10x more on garret etc etc

would have totally agreeif you had to change the turbo 4 times in 4 years it would still be cheaper than buying a garrett equivalent
 

grahams81

Active Member
Oct 14, 2010
1,165
6
County Durham
There are some guys trying ebay specials on vwvortex....i lost interest as there was too many pages, have a search in the 1.8T technical forum or forced induction ( i can't remember)

If you don't mind the possibility of having to sort out problems as they arise (handy yourself and not relying on garages) then there's no harm in trying. Like you say there cheap... you could buy probably 4-5 chinky specials to 1 garrett... that could last you a life time.

The thing is though they are copying turbo's that are old technology - journal bearings / older style housings etc.... your not going to get the same levels of spool / drivability from the cheap ones - they may make the same power but there's more to the equation than pure numbers.

You can get the Garrett units cheaper - there are gt3071's on ebay for a £1000 brand new.
If your willing to import from the US there are bigger savings to be had.

My mate runs a gt3076 ebay turbo on a scoooby and it's absolutely torture, spooling @5.5k powerful but only 1.5k worth of power band. That may be down to wrong housing size etc.
 

seatcupramad23

kc4even23
Sep 7, 2009
3,239
2
birmingham
There are some guys trying ebay specials on vwvortex....i lost interest as there was too many pages, have a search in the 1.8T technical forum or forced induction ( i can't remember)

If you don't mind the possibility of having to sort out problems as they arise (handy yourself and not relying on garages) then there's no harm in trying. Like you say there cheap... you could buy probably 4-5 chinky specials to 1 garrett... that could last you a life time.

The thing is though they are copying turbo's that are old technology - journal bearings / older style housings etc.... your not going to get the same levels of spool / drivability from the cheap ones - they may make the same power but there's more to the equation than pure numbers.

You can get the Garrett units cheaper - there are gt3071's on ebay for a £1000 brand new.
If your willing to import from the US there are bigger savings to be had.

My mate runs a gt3076 ebay turbo on a scoooby and it's absolutely torture, spooling @5.5k powerful but only 1.5k worth of power band. That may be down to wrong housing size etc.

while i agree to certain extent, looking at dyno graphs of a few on the cheap t3/4 turbos 0.5a/r 12psi by 3250rpm nice linear power and progressive torque while i'm in soubt its cheaper for a reason but by evidence of seeing cars running then they seem to be working out with the right mapping of course , a well known tuner in vag seen swear by them and even fitting one to is own car .

alot of things are coming into question recently ie £80 wellycoolers out performing £600 forge coolers so whats justifying the price gap ? name ?
 

grahams81

Active Member
Oct 14, 2010
1,165
6
County Durham
while i agree to certain extent, looking at dyno graphs of a few on the cheap t3/4 turbos 0.5a/r 12psi by 3250rpm nice linear power and progressive torque while i'm in soubt its cheaper for a reason but by evidence of seeing cars running then they seem to be working out with the right mapping of course , a well known tuner in vag seen swear by them and even fitting one to is own car .

alot of things are coming into question recently ie £80 wellycoolers out performing £600 forge coolers so whats justifying the price gap ? name ?

I would be interested to see some comparisons between similar sized turbos - 0.5a/r is quite small so should spool quickly.

I would only take "claims" of out performing turbo's / intercoolers with a pinch of salt... unless back to back dyno's or logging on the same car.

To some people genuine parts will always appear to be "overpriced" compared to copes -cos they see something like a turbo and think £1000 selling price - bah bet it only costs them £250 to make in materials...
But companies like garrett spend millions a year on R&D, tech support, wages & pensions (not in chinese sweat shops) / the economy of the country its made in etc etc - the only way they can develop these products is by passing on the costs through the parts they sell (overheads)

Then after all that hard work.....It only takes a chinese engineering firm 1 day to copy the design (no patents in China) and start producing them with cheap labour / cheap materials etc.

They can then turn out the "same" part for 4-10 times cheaper.

So in a way by buying a genuine turbo etc your probably helping with future development with companies like garrett etc but not everyone can afford them / want to overpay.

I think US / UK companies will struggle in the future if the chinese really start producing good kit - i would hate to see companies like forge / Garrett close down due to a influx of copied goods.

Personally i think for the good of the worlds manufacturing then china should not be allowed to ignore patents.

So to sum up i don't think it's a simple as buying "named" designer clothes - i think buying named engineered goods your paying for the R&D, & Support etc.
 
i recently purchased a ebay turbo from america rated to 550bhp and have seen lots of cars running this turbo with no problems at all. but as mentioned they spool up a bit later due to being journal bearing and not ball type. i have stripped it down and checked it over and for the £200 i paid for it its excellent quality and i can find nothing wrong with it in comparison to other named turbos i have had in the past.

as for chinese copies remember a few top gear episodes back where they say we will all be driving cars made in china due to how fast their development has improved so i would say chinese copies are not good from 10 years ago but today they aint bad at all. and in another 10 years time will probably be as good if not better than the leading brands.
 

traumapat

Leon Cupra IHI
Jul 24, 2005
5,925
4
sunny sussex
The big picture here is that for companies to stay competitive they would have to stream line things and lose their R&D. The likes of Pro Alloy and forge would settle for just making coolers and dvs, rather than continuous improvement . Thats no more new shiney stuff..

It would be good if anyone can find 2 dynos that show the differences, power band is everything on a turbo car.

Im not against low prices but would rather buy branded for the back up and experience rather than something that has been produced simply from a profit point of view...

I can see why a turbo that gives you a huge grin for a quarter of the price of a branded one is a worth while buy. But what would you use to stop your new monster? £1000 worth of brembos and lines or a £250 copy made by some manufacturer in China from ebay?
 

MJ

Public transport abuser
Apr 22, 2008
5,508
13
Manchester
m.facebook.com
The stereotype of chinesse stuff being rubbish or poor quality is a thing of the past these days and I think European, uk and American companies will have to work very hard to compeat in the future Market place.
 

seatcupramad23

kc4even23
Sep 7, 2009
3,239
2
birmingham
The stereotype of chinesse stuff being rubbish or poor quality is a thing of the past these days and I think European, uk and American companies will have to work very hard to compeat in the future Market place.

+1 we can get on our high horses and talk about morals but thats be hypocritical most the stuff we eat and use is done by cheap labour. I do think chinese products have really step the game up
 

ibiza_95

1.8T MK2 Conversion
i personally wouldnt risk it either... yea the cost of a turbo is a couple hundred pounds and easy to replace should it go tits up but what if it loses a wheel inside your engine? or a bit of bearing shoots in there... then its a lot more than a couple of hundred pound a time :/
 

westallc

Active Member
Jan 25, 2009
132
0
gut on another forum running 12sec flat quater miles on an ebay turbo and he abuses the car all day every day been going strong for a couple of years no issues tells you alot imo
 

Leon2012

Active Member
Jan 24, 2012
480
1
To some people genuine parts will always appear to be "overpriced" compared to copes -cos they see something like a turbo and think £1000 selling price - bah bet it only costs them £250 to make in materials...

I've heard Garrett sell them to the manufacturers for a lot less than £250...
 

grahams81

Active Member
Oct 14, 2010
1,165
6
County Durham
I've heard Garrett sell them to the manufacturers for a lot less than £250...

Garrett is a manufacturer, do you mean they sell them to dealers for £250, if so then it makes no sense for a dealer to make a £1000 on a turbo when the manufacturer would make £100.....

Lets face it nobody outside of a dealer / manufacturer knows how much they cost to make, or supplied price.
People can speculate they cost peanuts to make..... Does anybody thinking this know whats involved in machining castings / dies.....

All i can say is someone should buy all the ebay kit and do some testing and we'll all learn from it.....
 
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