a new diesel tuning company
- Thread starter zach225
- Start date
I can 1000000000% assure you Zachs just a happy customer and so am I. Going back for my stage3 hybrid turbo as soon as I can afford it too 
Looked on their site and it looks like a kid doing gcse ICT has done it....
If they have copied from darkside then that's sooo low and i imagine illigal? Ill stick with the real deal.
Sent from my LG-P920 using Tapatalk 2
If they have copied from darkside then that's sooo low and i imagine illigal? Ill stick with the real deal.
Sent from my LG-P920 using Tapatalk 2
Would anyone like a slice of plagiarism with that?
i have only ever heard good things about darkside, myself being from the inner circle of the vag tuning scene. Given they have hit on a good thing and it's only been a matter of time before someone has taken the same ideas and started under cutting them, in this case it would seem in the most hard faced way possible.
Sounds like these chaps are very good at tactical bullshitting, seen the same thing in the past with various companies, will they still be about in 12 months once they've made their quick buck? Who knows.
i have only ever heard good things about darkside, myself being from the inner circle of the vag tuning scene. Given they have hit on a good thing and it's only been a matter of time before someone has taken the same ideas and started under cutting them, in this case it would seem in the most hard faced way possible.
Sounds like these chaps are very good at tactical bullshitting, seen the same thing in the past with various companies, will they still be about in 12 months once they've made their quick buck? Who knows.
wow it was just a review, maybe help a starting business out, maybe help out some members who may want some work done....
not fighting their corner at all. its just you have only heard one side, and i dont remember saying i have a problem with darkside? and have infact spent over £2000 with them.
make your own mind up i dont care, you probably wont be using either company anyway..
not fighting their corner at all. its just you have only heard one side, and i dont remember saying i have a problem with darkside? and have infact spent over £2000 with them.
make your own mind up i dont care, you probably wont be using either company anyway..
We have held off from doing this for a while now after stumbling across the Dirty Torque website, but since Dean and Karl are now getting customers to plug them on the forums and also dropping hints about their turbo kits when people ask about our kits, I think it is time we tell the truth on how Dirty Torque Developments came about.
I own Darkside Developments with my bro Ryan.
Dean from DTD bought an old turbo setup from Ryan around April last year. From there he sent over 200 emails asking about everything you can imagine to do with diesel tuning. When he was down on cash we helped him out by buying some parts from him for much more than we usually would. We even sold him Powergate Tool so he could tune the ECUs as he wanted to be a 'dealer' for our products and needed us to help him set up a website to advertise the products on. He would be our ‘fitting centre’ down South.
Dean knew who we used for some of our fabrication work, and must have decided to cut us out of the picture. We later found out that Dean drove from getting a load of money from us, straight to the fabricator to discuss their new business venture!
We used this particular fabricator for 1 Manifold and some flanges. All the flanges were all bent and the manifold had very poor welding, so we decided not to use him again. Since then we have heard some horror stories of the manifolds he makes breaking and poor customer service etc.
We paid for the jig for the manifold and the CAD for the flanges so it is yet another stepping stone we created for DTD.
Since we declined to help Dean with the website (why should we help someone set up a business?), he seems to have took it upon himself to use all of our information as his own.
Take a look at their Turbo Kit listing:
http://www.dirty-tor...ts/show/3059915
Look familiar?
http://www.darksided...di-engines.html
It’s a pretty much copy and paste affair of ours in most part.
Also, did they show you their ‘Demo Car’?
‘We currently run this turbo kit on our own Skoda Fabia Vrs TDI PD130 Demo Car which achieves 235bhp /360lbsft’
Have you seen this before? Yep you sure have:
.JPG)
We fitted that kit with our own bare hands as well as doing all the tuning, it was one of the first we did. Karl, Dean’s brother bought it from the customer we did all the work for (Luke) and now they are passing it off as their work!
If price is all someone is bothered about, I am sure they will go with the DirtyTorque Kit, but we have sold 70 Turbo Kits in just over 18 months, so that shows you something. We used Brand New Genuine Garrett Turbochargers with a 1 Year Warranty, and our Manifolds and Downpipes have a lifetime warranty against cracking. You need to compare apples with apples. Their kits are a little cheaper than ours, but we don’t make a crazy amount on them, so something has got to give. You squeeze on price, you have the squeeze on quality somewhere.
I am sure Dean will come up with some crazy story about how we are lying and that everything was their own idea, but he thinks we are stupid, getting his brother and friends to email us and ring us to ask advice on what to fit etc. Its not clever, it just makes them look like novices.
They are also claiming 328bhp at the flywheel with a set of Firad 80% Injectors. I have no doubt the Injectors will do that power, but there is no way the stock head and camshaft will flow that amount of power, no matter how much fuel, NOS, Water/Meth or fairy dust you pile in there.
You can buy the fake Adidas, or buy the real deal. Its your choice.
Thanks
Scott
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Hy Scott
Reminds me of that guy buying your parts and selling cheapo-copies of them on ebay the other day....
People who want outstandig quality will make the correct decision, don't worry ;-)
BR
Alex
at the risk of further 'fighting their corner'..
id like to point out this isnt about them copying darkside....
they just also offer a similar kit.
if you check on briskskoda you will see they have had a number of happy customers who have posted about them, all from hybrid turbos to standard mechanics...
id like to point out this isnt about them copying darkside....
they just also offer a similar kit.
if you check on briskskoda you will see they have had a number of happy customers who have posted about them, all from hybrid turbos to standard mechanics...
George Agdgdgwn
Guest
I don't think anyone needs to jump on Zach here. He wanted one of our turbo kits, but found someone selling ours cheaper (as it was used) and they were closer than us so could help with the mapping and fitting. He has been a good customer to us to so I am not complaining (didn't realise it was the same Zach until he said).
In regards to the maps, I said on BriSkoda, they are using Mike @ TDTuning in the USA, so they will be good. We used him for a while last year, but as we got busier the time difference became and issue. He is in bed when we are up, and vice versa. Its no fun mapping a car at 6am and 10pm!
Me and Ryan actually flew out to California and drove over to see Mike in Las Vegas.
We did a lot of development work with Mike so I suppose its another stepping stone we created for them. We even sold them the tool to use Mike's tunes as they were just going to do the odd car on a night.
Yes Alex, the guys who can only imitate rather than innovate will not last too long There is no 'quick buck' in this game, you have to be prepared to put in the time and effort.
Thanks
Scott
In regards to the maps, I said on BriSkoda, they are using Mike @ TDTuning in the USA, so they will be good. We used him for a while last year, but as we got busier the time difference became and issue. He is in bed when we are up, and vice versa. Its no fun mapping a car at 6am and 10pm!
Me and Ryan actually flew out to California and drove over to see Mike in Las Vegas.
We did a lot of development work with Mike so I suppose its another stepping stone we created for them. We even sold them the tool to use Mike's tunes as they were just going to do the odd car on a night.
Hy Scott
Reminds me of that guy buying your parts and selling cheapo-copies of them on ebay the other day....
People who want outstandig quality will make the correct decision, don't worry ;-)
BR
Alex
Yes Alex, the guys who can only imitate rather than innovate will not last too long
There is no 'quick buck' in this game, you have to be prepared to put in the time and effort.Thanks
Scott
as much as i can see the lack of the professionalism on the website there feedback seems good im neither for or against them at the end of the day it doesnt matter what business you are in they have all had to use tactical bulls##t some where along the line its part of business.
also a good product will always be copied and made cheaper by another company as the first company would have put all the man hours in to make the product from scratch where as the next company will just copy it quickly and easily so it will be made cheaper thats the way it is doesnt mean the product is bad.
no, it doesn't mean the product is bad at all, but if they have been as underhanded and generally shitty as suggested about how they have started up their business then I think it potentially says a lot about them as people and I wouldn't want any to do with them
Not trying to throw a spanner in the works and I normally avoid posts such as these but Zach the thread below you are saying you have a boost leak after you recently had turbo upgrade which I am guessing is from the same company. How can you recommend a company when you have issues on your car after they have done work?
Sully
Sully
Ummm maybe because its not their fault one of my mikalor clamps wasn't tight enough? They didn't fit the intercooler I did, and it wasn't leaking when I left them. It was my driving that caused it. And in fairness to dean he offered a multitude of times to help find the leak and we spoke daily about what it could be, it wasn't worth the 2 1/2 hr each way drive tho when it's something I can do
Your other thread didn't indicate this the last posts was about you going back to the mapper to look at of the boost figures were correct.
Not wanting to pick on you so hope you didn't feel that way just seemed like a strange coincidence.
Sully
Not wanting to pick on you so hope you didn't feel that way just seemed like a strange coincidence.
Sully
I am going back to have the boost figures looked at, at the same time they install my firad 80%+ nozzles
Was waiting for a post like this to come along…
“Dean knew who we used for some of our fabrication work, and must have decided to cut us out of the picture………………..
We used this particular fabricator for 1 Manifold and some flanges. All the flanges were all bent and the manifold had very poor welding, so we decided not to use him again. Since then we have heard some horror stories of the manifolds he makes breaking and poor customer service etc.”
The manifold fabricator in question is Ricky from Race Tech. Known the world over in Honda circles and his company has made and sold countless turbo manifolds for various makes and models of very high end big power cars. I already knew Ricky and the quality of his work, as I have had two civic turbos with his work sitting proudly in the engine bay doing exactly what they were designed and made to do with no problems at all. I also know a lot of people who run and swear by race tech gear. A link for those who do not know this company: http://www.race-tech.net/
“Since we declined to help Dean with the website (why should we help someone set up a business?), he seems to have took it upon himself to use all of our information as his own.”
All of the information on our site is openly available on the internet. As we are selling a similar turbo kit to your own, then the details will obviously be similar too.
“We fitted that kit with our own bare hands as well as doing all the tuning, it was one of the first we did. Karl, Dean’s brother bought it from the customer we did all the work for (Luke) and now they are passing it off as their work!”
This is simply not true! Your kit was removed from the car almost immediately after we got it home. We bought the fabia, as it worked out a cheap base car when we factored in all the supporting mods (clutch/flywheel, miltek exhaust, intercooler, big brakes) and selling you kit on to reclaim some of the cost. Our first kit was designed and most of the way through being built when we bought the fabia. It was being made to go onto my seat Ibiza pd130 but as the car had a previous revo remap, we couldn’t get into the ecu with the powergate computer we bought from you (which you sold to us knowing we were going to use it to make a profit using it and that wasn’t a problem for you). Just because our kit uses the same turbo as yours doesn’t mean it’s a copy. It means it’s “inspired by” yours. A scan through google shows that this turbo is being used on vag tdi conversions all over the place not using your kit. The only bit we have copied is the part number. Below you will see two photos which I took in the brief time that the two turbo kits were side by side on the swap over.
You will notice how our manifold is a lot shorter to help keep the manifold away from the back of the engine bay and prevent damage to pipes and wiring by the heat (something which had already been an issue on the fabia). Also note that our downpipe, is 2.5” all the way through, which will help with a smoother transition into the miltek (or any other 2.5”) exhaust causing less of a heat spot at the end of the downpipe. This is not a copy, these are redesigned components. The fact that we are building kits for the same cars, again, means that the products will look similar in key areas.
“They are also claiming 328bhp at the flywheel with a set of Firad 80% Injectors. I have no doubt the Injectors will do that power, but there is no way the stock head and camshaft will flow that amount of power, no matter how much fuel, NOS, Water/Meth or fairy dust you pile in there.”
That is the power it made on the dyno. Again, this was done on racetech’s dyno. This was on a very smoky map which will be reserved for track use and is undoubtably pushing everything to its limits. How can we test these things if we don’t push them?
I don’t intend to get into a slanging match on this matter and I have never said a bad word about you guys at Darkside. The quality of your kit is top notch (as is ours ) and your success proves this. I hope this has helped to dispel a couple of myths floating about right now. This will be the last I post on this subject.
Cheers,
Dean
“Dean knew who we used for some of our fabrication work, and must have decided to cut us out of the picture………………..
We used this particular fabricator for 1 Manifold and some flanges. All the flanges were all bent and the manifold had very poor welding, so we decided not to use him again. Since then we have heard some horror stories of the manifolds he makes breaking and poor customer service etc.”
The manifold fabricator in question is Ricky from Race Tech. Known the world over in Honda circles and his company has made and sold countless turbo manifolds for various makes and models of very high end big power cars. I already knew Ricky and the quality of his work, as I have had two civic turbos with his work sitting proudly in the engine bay doing exactly what they were designed and made to do with no problems at all. I also know a lot of people who run and swear by race tech gear. A link for those who do not know this company: http://www.race-tech.net/
“Since we declined to help Dean with the website (why should we help someone set up a business?), he seems to have took it upon himself to use all of our information as his own.”
All of the information on our site is openly available on the internet. As we are selling a similar turbo kit to your own, then the details will obviously be similar too.
“We fitted that kit with our own bare hands as well as doing all the tuning, it was one of the first we did. Karl, Dean’s brother bought it from the customer we did all the work for (Luke) and now they are passing it off as their work!”
This is simply not true! Your kit was removed from the car almost immediately after we got it home. We bought the fabia, as it worked out a cheap base car when we factored in all the supporting mods (clutch/flywheel, miltek exhaust, intercooler, big brakes) and selling you kit on to reclaim some of the cost. Our first kit was designed and most of the way through being built when we bought the fabia. It was being made to go onto my seat Ibiza pd130 but as the car had a previous revo remap, we couldn’t get into the ecu with the powergate computer we bought from you (which you sold to us knowing we were going to use it to make a profit using it and that wasn’t a problem for you). Just because our kit uses the same turbo as yours doesn’t mean it’s a copy. It means it’s “inspired by” yours. A scan through google shows that this turbo is being used on vag tdi conversions all over the place not using your kit. The only bit we have copied is the part number. Below you will see two photos which I took in the brief time that the two turbo kits were side by side on the swap over.
You will notice how our manifold is a lot shorter to help keep the manifold away from the back of the engine bay and prevent damage to pipes and wiring by the heat (something which had already been an issue on the fabia). Also note that our downpipe, is 2.5” all the way through, which will help with a smoother transition into the miltek (or any other 2.5”) exhaust causing less of a heat spot at the end of the downpipe. This is not a copy, these are redesigned components. The fact that we are building kits for the same cars, again, means that the products will look similar in key areas.
“They are also claiming 328bhp at the flywheel with a set of Firad 80% Injectors. I have no doubt the Injectors will do that power, but there is no way the stock head and camshaft will flow that amount of power, no matter how much fuel, NOS, Water/Meth or fairy dust you pile in there.”
That is the power it made on the dyno. Again, this was done on racetech’s dyno. This was on a very smoky map which will be reserved for track use and is undoubtably pushing everything to its limits. How can we test these things if we don’t push them?
I don’t intend to get into a slanging match on this matter and I have never said a bad word about you guys at Darkside. The quality of your kit is top notch (as is ours
) and your success proves this. I hope this has helped to dispel a couple of myths floating about right now. This will be the last I post on this subject.Cheers,
Dean
George Agdgdgwn
Guest
Hi Dean,
Was hoping you would reply. You were expecting this, guilty conscience?
People will believe what they want to believe, no matter what you or I say, but its a very strange coincidence that you buy a car with our Turbo Kit on, and then all of a sudden you have your own turbo kit. I am sure there were just as well spec’d up cars for less money that didn't have a turbo kit already fitted.
The main point is you sent over 200 emails asking everything you could about diesel tuning, on the basis that you were going to be one of our dealers. We told you information we would not usually give so freely to a competitor. You didn’t even have the decency to let us know you were going on your own, and even continued to email afterwards.
That manifold is the design Ricky did for us when we had the one manifold from him, super short with 45 degree bends for the collector, not very good for flow or Exhaust Gas Temperatures.
.JPG)
.JPG)
We have 70 of the kits all over the world, in various applications with no issues, so I think we would know by now if there were any. When Luke first bought the kit, we had a longer manifold that touched the A/C Pipes slightly, so we brought his car up to our workshop and completely redesigned the manifold so it was nowhere near any of the wires (what wires?) and A/c pipes. We even drove down on a Sunday morning when he was fitting it with his Dad to look at the issues in person.
Your Turbo kit listing is basically a copy and paste of ours, even Stevie Wonder can see that.
Heat spots on the 3" to 2.5" reducer for the Downpipe? Do you have any evidence or studies to back this up? Considering the exhaust temperature will be pretty low by the end of the downpipe, I think you have solved a problem that does not exist.
So you believe the 328bhp from the over reading Race-Tech dyno? I don’t care how much fuel you have put in that and how much it smokes, the cam and head WILL NOT flow 328bhp without major work. Maybe to the less educated crowd it seems viable, but you lose all credibility to the educated customers with wild claims like that. I will pay for a dyno run on any that we have run our cars on to prove this.
We have run our cars on loads of Dynos and the only graphs we post up are the ones that make sense. Any from the DynoDynamics we use are the lowest we ever had. Not many tuning companies would post up the lowest figures they have achieved would they?
We sell ourselves short on the power figures, but that’s why we have Race Teams, Custom Car Builders and Tuning companies all over the world selling and using our products.
I have no problem with competition; competition is good for customers and breeds creativity. What I don’t like is someone back stabbing, copying and passing off our products, knowledge and information as their own.
I can sleep soundly knowing I have not made anything up. I have all the emails to prove it.
Thanks
Scott
Was hoping you would reply. You were expecting this, guilty conscience?
People will believe what they want to believe, no matter what you or I say, but its a very strange coincidence that you buy a car with our Turbo Kit on, and then all of a sudden you have your own turbo kit. I am sure there were just as well spec’d up cars for less money that didn't have a turbo kit already fitted.
The main point is you sent over 200 emails asking everything you could about diesel tuning, on the basis that you were going to be one of our dealers. We told you information we would not usually give so freely to a competitor. You didn’t even have the decency to let us know you were going on your own, and even continued to email afterwards.
That manifold is the design Ricky did for us when we had the one manifold from him, super short with 45 degree bends for the collector, not very good for flow or Exhaust Gas Temperatures.
We have 70 of the kits all over the world, in various applications with no issues, so I think we would know by now if there were any. When Luke first bought the kit, we had a longer manifold that touched the A/C Pipes slightly, so we brought his car up to our workshop and completely redesigned the manifold so it was nowhere near any of the wires (what wires?) and A/c pipes. We even drove down on a Sunday morning when he was fitting it with his Dad to look at the issues in person.
Your Turbo kit listing is basically a copy and paste of ours, even Stevie Wonder can see that.
Heat spots on the 3" to 2.5" reducer for the Downpipe? Do you have any evidence or studies to back this up? Considering the exhaust temperature will be pretty low by the end of the downpipe, I think you have solved a problem that does not exist.
So you believe the 328bhp from the over reading Race-Tech dyno? I don’t care how much fuel you have put in that and how much it smokes, the cam and head WILL NOT flow 328bhp without major work. Maybe to the less educated crowd it seems viable, but you lose all credibility to the educated customers with wild claims like that. I will pay for a dyno run on any that we have run our cars on to prove this.
We have run our cars on loads of Dynos and the only graphs we post up are the ones that make sense. Any from the DynoDynamics we use are the lowest we ever had. Not many tuning companies would post up the lowest figures they have achieved would they?
We sell ourselves short on the power figures, but that’s why we have Race Teams, Custom Car Builders and Tuning companies all over the world selling and using our products.
I have no problem with competition; competition is good for customers and breeds creativity. What I don’t like is someone back stabbing, copying and passing off our products, knowledge and information as their own.
I can sleep soundly knowing I have not made anything up. I have all the emails to prove it.
Thanks
Scott
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