ABS, a dog, and a question

Mozz

Guest
Well, my ABS might have just saved a dog. A stupid dog.

Was coming into a right bend through a village, doing about 30, when I see this little dog crossing the road halfway round this bend, heading for my side of the road. I start braking, thinking it might stop, but it doesn't, and the brake pedal starts kicking. I guess I must have hit a patch of frost, or maybe grit, I don't know 'cause I was looking at this dog. I didn't think I was actually going to stop in time, and actually started trying to swerve as the car stopped. It ended up that I couldn't see it's feet 'cause the bonnet was in the way, guess that would put it about a yard off my bumper? Daft thing carried on with barely a glance at me.

This is my first car with ABS (53 Seat Ibiza), and I've not had much chance to try it out. I realised after I'd stopped that I hadn't put my foot down any harder on the pedal after it started kicking rapidly and constantly. It occured to me that ABS might have nearly squashed a dog because I'd not used it properly :confused:

So, the question is, once the ABS is working constantly, does it make any difference how much harder you try and push the pedal down? I tried testing it out on a nice patch of thick frost, and it didn't seem to. It seemed that once it reached that point, the pedal had that much resistance to it that I couldn't push it down any further anyway?
 
ABS works simply by detecting when the brake capliers lock onto the brake disk even when the car is still moving. When it detects this it very quickly releases the brake (which is the kick you feel) so that the wheels can turn and you have control over the car. This happens many times a second. It's complicated by Audis Brake Force Distribution system which will cary the pressure at all 4 wheels if depending on the ammount of grip available and also to keep the car breaking in a straight line.

To me it sounds as though your car is working fine. I've had a few moments like that, and it feels as though the car isn't going to stop, but then just before you hit something it does stop. Almost as though it only decides to stop in the last meter before impact.
 

ibizacupra

Jack-RIP my little Friend
Jul 25, 2001
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glos.uk
Its a well known fact that ABS does not stop you any sooner than non ABS, but you do retain steering control to avoid things whilst being on the anchors. Press as hard as you like, ABS comes in and does its thing. ABS pumps on some models have a boost pressure (accumulator in them) so brake pressure is quite high when needed.

Pressing the pedal harder when ABS is already running should make no difference. Pressing it hard enough to activate is a lot of peoples failing apparently.
 
Jan 29, 2003
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Its an ibiza... so, same as the fabia... i think the abs is dangerous...

Theres been several occasions now (one where ive not been so lucky) for me and others where the abs has kicked in and actually pretty much reduced the braking force to almost nothing.... the problem seems to be, if one wheel goes over a grid or something, triggering it... it takes several seconds to sort itself, in which time braking force is very much reduced...
 

dmjw01

Upstanding Member
Jul 28, 2005
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Woking, UK
www.dmjwilliams.co.uk
The ABS activated on me for the first time a few days ago. It certainly didn't reduce the braking force.

The problem with ABS is a psychological one. When it kicks in, it's such an odd feeling that some people reduce the pressure they're applying to the brake pedal.
 

ibizacupra

Jack-RIP my little Friend
Jul 25, 2001
31,333
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glos.uk
Neo_VR said:
Its an ibiza... so, same as the fabia... i think the abs is dangerous...

Theres been several occasions now (one where ive not been so lucky) for me and others where the abs has kicked in and actually pretty much reduced the braking force to almost nothing.... the problem seems to be, if one wheel goes over a grid or something, triggering it... it takes several seconds to sort itself, in which time braking force is very much reduced...

I woudl have hoped the mk4 ibiza has better abs system than the mk3 (like mine) cos I have to agree its fecking dangerous... No Brakes.... :wtf:
 

ibizacupra

Jack-RIP my little Friend
Jul 25, 2001
31,333
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glos.uk
dmjw01 said:
The ABS activated on me for the first time a few days ago. It certainly didn't reduce the braking force.

The problem with ABS is a psychological one. When it kicks in, it's such an odd feeling that some people reduce the pressure they're applying to the brake pedal.

I it runs like the mk3 system does, its too slow to react, pumps the pedal up rigid and you have ZERO brakes... Rears activate the way too soon IMHO, and the ABS pump cycle goes on for what feels like forever, in which time things getr very hairy.

Nasty POS system, which is removed from mine now thankfully.

I would rather no ABS than ibiza ABS
 
Jan 29, 2003
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ibizacupra said:
I it runs like the mk3 system does, its too slow to react, pumps the pedal up rigid and you have ZERO brakes... Rears activate the way too soon IMHO, and the ABS pump cycle goes on for what feels like forever, in which time things getr very hairy.

Nasty POS system, which is removed from mine now thankfully.

I would rather no ABS than ibiza ABS

Yep.. id have to agree.. same effect on the fabia (and i presume ibiza mk4 too)

once i get to grips with vagcom.. im gonna look into reducing sensitivity, as its so not configured properly for these small cars with light back ends
 

mjstokes85

Diesel Power
Nov 14, 2005
1,519
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Long Eaton
My ABS came into play for the 1st time yesterday, had to slam the brakes on as someone pulled out and felt the pedal pumping. Thought i'd done bad at 1st :blink:
 

EdButler

Full Member
Apr 24, 2005
713
1
Sheffield
I personally think its best to cadence break if you have time, let off slightly to stop the ABS biting...

If you need to turn whilst breaking tho just let the abs pump away cos its the only way youll turn whilst emergency-braking in these recent road conditions.
 

Triple D

Guest
When i did some product traing at work i actually found out that if you were to slam the breaks on in a straight line a car with abs takes a longer distance to stop than a car without abs but if your doing it around a corner or had to steer away from something then abs would allow you to still break hard and turn at the same time.
 

Triple D

Guest
dmjw01 said:
The ABS activated on me for the first time a few days ago.
All you people that haven't had your abs kick since having the car obviously haven't been driving or trying hard enough :whistle: . Mines kicked in loads whilst racing other cars or going for a blast around country roads. Ill admit that when i first had my 1.4 sx two days after i got it i slammed the ankers on just to see what the car would do ( as this was my first car with abs) and it did feel wierd.
 

Mozz

Guest
ibizacupra said:
Pressing the pedal harder when ABS is already running should make no difference. Pressing it hard enough to activate is a lot of peoples failing apparently.
I'm now really glad I made a point of trying it out a few times when I first got the car to make sure I wouldn't get completely taken by surprise by it. I'm sure there are a few accidents every year from people leaping off the pedal because it feels like something's wrong.

Shame there isn't a switch to turn ABS off for a bit. It'd be interesting to try stopping with and without in the same place.
 

Mozz

Guest
EdButler said:
I personally think its best to cadence break if you have time, let off slightly to stop the ABS biting...

If you need to turn whilst breaking tho just let the abs pump away cos its the only way youll turn whilst emergency-braking in these recent road conditions.

I'll try out cadence braking next time we have some good frost, see if it makes a difference.

Probably was best just to let the ABS work that time, seeing as I was going round a corner. I wonder what it would have been like in my old pug?
 

Jay'sFR

Full Member
Sep 18, 2004
59
0
Yorkshire
The ABS is dangerous on my car. I have had a few close calls due to it, so much so I have just bought a set of TT brakes to try and reduce it. I had a mark 4 Golf GTI 20VT and never had any problems with that. I have even taken it to the dealer after the first time it tried to wipe me out. If it wasn't for potential insurance ramifications I would turn it off.
In my experience the ABS has provided more opportunity for accident than accident avoidance.
 

Triple D

Guest
Jay'sFR said:
The ABS is dangerous on my car. I have had a few close calls due to it, so much so I have just bought a set of TT brakes to try and reduce it.
They are much better, i hardly get any abs kicking in now as before it used to happen even at slow speeds when turning at a junction. I still get it when giving them a pasteing but you would expect them to as they are so big. Standard brakes are s**t, im sure anyone can recomend upgrading brakes first of all, even if they are to the tt312 set up, a cheap but well cost effective mod, but if your feeling really flush go for Brembo's or Tarox 6 pots as they'll be even better.
 

muddyboots

Still hanging around
Oct 16, 2002
5,739
1
dmjw01 said:
When it kicks in, it's such an odd feeling that some people reduce the pressure they're applying to the brake pedal.
I think that's why modern cars (including the Mk4) have EBA - Emergency Brake Assist. It tries to work out whether you're braking in an emergency, and applies full braking power and holds it on for a short period, even if you don't press the pedal hard enough or lift off because of the ABS pedal feel.
 
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