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Brand realignment

Discussion in 'SEAT brand general discussion' started by R3k1355, Oct 1, 2019.

  1. R3k1355

    R3k1355 Active Member

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    According to a recent news article VAG are considering changing the positioning of the Seat and Skoda brands.

    The Skoda brand will move into a cheaper price bracket, to target buyers in Eastern Europe and compete against brands like Kia and Dacia.
    The Seat brand will move into a more expensive price bracket, to compete with brands like Alfa Romeo (I assume that will put them price-wise between VW and Audi).
     
    Syphon likes this.
  2. Pferdestarke

    Pferdestarke Active Member

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    SEAT can’t just increase price beyond VW without first improving quality. And I don’t think Skoda poses a threat to SEAT, however SEAT does to VW and Audi.

    Anyway, I’d better read the article.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  3. The Daily Meme

    The Daily Meme MY20 Cupra 290 Lux

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    Since the Mk3 leon came out and the equivalent Ibiza i think Seat has been a better car in most ways compared to VW

    Audi still remains the more premium of the 4 because they are expensive. People like to be seen driving them, the same with VW. They are like the iPhones of the car market. People buy them because they think other people think they are cool. I remember back in 2011 i thought the golf was cool. But again, since the mk3 leon. I'd have a leon over a golf any day.

    I also like how audi seem to lead the way with tech, they were one of the first to have LED lights on their cars, they started the dynamic indicators, the dynamic chassis and all that other gucci kit which now comes as standard on a lot of VAG cars. BMW have only in the last couple of years started replacing their head and tail lights with LEDs. and BMW interiors are only just catching up with the likes of premium audi and Mercedes cars.

    When people ask, if you could have any car on the market right now, I'd either get an RS3. But since I can't afford one, a Cupra has all the kit a high spec S3 has at a much better price. And still out does any golf i've seen on looks.

    The amount of times people have said, "ew, why do you drive a SEAT" and then I put my foot down and they realise I got a nicer looking golf for a lot less and with better performance.

    Ex girlfriend had a golf, by the end of the relationship she was jealous of my leon. more power, better looking and cheaper.

    :seatgod:
     
    Wings988 likes this.
  4. R3k1355

    R3k1355 Active Member

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    I just don't feel that the general public aspire to own a Seat like they would a Audi/BMW/Merc so I'm not sure pumping the price up is a good move.

    Especially if you're looking to target Alfa's market segment, mostly nutters.
     
  5. The Daily Meme

    The Daily Meme MY20 Cupra 290 Lux

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    They can’t put the price up without offering something return.
    And I don’t mean doing what they do with Audi’s by charging above Cupra prices for an S3 and then expecting you to pay for every single optional extra to get it to the same spec as a Cupra Lux
     
  6. perelaar

    perelaar Active Member

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    Original article (in German, and behind a login, but intro is free): https://www.automobilwoche.de/article/20190929/BCONLINE/190929933/vw-scharft-seine-marken

    Indeed: idea would be for Seat to make "more emotional" cars; not sure Mr Jost actually said anything about price increases or if it is free interpretation by the journalist. I'll try to get the full article tomorrow.

    More important: platform for electric cars to be shared among the entire VAG group, and fuel cells are on the way.
     
  7. R3k1355

    R3k1355 Active Member

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    I think it was inferred due to the comparison with Alfa Romeo, and the current market position being cheaper than VW.

    Unless of course emotional just means 'breaks down all the time like an Alfa' which I'm sure you could easily deliver at the current price point.
     
  8. mdaw1985

    mdaw1985 Active Member

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    I’d have thought the interior quality although good in our Leon's would need to at least match the golf if that was the case. Currently from what I can see just looking at the golf from the outside it looks like it has slightly more soft touch plastics etc. Like on the rear doors and more of the dashboard. My exeo had a slightly better overall quality than my Leon and that was based on a car (2005 A4) 14 years ago.
     
  9. RUM4MO

    RUM4MO Active Member

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    Now that you have mentioned Exeo, being an older Audi A4 design and so better quality because of that, I bought a 2000 B5 VW Passat 4Motion brand new and was very impressed by its general quality of fittings and finish so thought that VW was a high quality brand - wrong, alter I worked out that that VW Passat was a good car due to it being made up of older Audi B5 A4 parts and some S6 parts! That awakening came when my wife thought that she would her next car to be a VW Polo, so that was what was bought to replace her trusty Ford Fiesta 1.6i with the Zetec engine in it, by the time that car was almost 5 years old, it had worked its way through far too much money and they reason was, in my mind, that it was based on the Skoda Fabia, and so most of the running gear was manufactured in Skoda factories or Skoda CZ based supplier's factories - an absolute dog of a car to work on and it needed working on lots of times to rid it of the crappy CZ made original parts. Unfortunately her next car is a 2015 VW Polo, it still has some Skoda or CZ built parts which include the engine!!
     
  10. Philip Santi

    Philip Santi Active Member

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    I've just read a similar article in Autocar where it talks about rebranding the whole of Seat as Cupra. Reading through the comments, I agree with most of one of the posts; It's not the first time VAG have mooted this.

    Last time I heard similar the plan was something like this:

    Audi = Executive/Premium brand
    VW = Quality/Family brand
    Seat = Sportier brand
    Skoda = Entry/budget brand

    But my own thoughts about this are, that with the advent of common platforms across the group, the differences have become so small in the cost of the main components that;

    Skoda have made a great product but they're no longer the bargain they were - they have a strong following who are loyal to the brand, so if someone want's to progress to a sportier model, they invariably go for a vRS and stay with the brand if they want quality/family cars because they're slightly cheaper and generally bigger than VW
    Seat's position as the 'Sportier' brand has suffered with the introduction and popularity of the various Golf hot hatches (Performance versions of the GTi, the R etc) - headline figures 'push' some buyers towards VW
    VW is still the 'staple' brand and with it getting the most powerful engines before Seat, eats into Seat's position in the group
    Audi is still the premium brand but also will take those looking for the more expensive end of the Hot Hatch/Sports market (S3, RS3, S4, etc)

    The Cupra Ateca is a good start re-claiming the Sportier niche - why the Leon R and R ST were not branded at Cupra with the ABT packs as an option on all 3 models, I have no idea?

    Anyway, there's my two'penneth :cheeky:
     
  11. RUM4MO

    RUM4MO Active Member

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    I think that newer SEAT models will, at certain levels become Cupra "brand". VW with their R-Line kind of annoyed me when I was looking for a new Polo for my wife back in April 2015 " the new model is a lot more R than R-Line" - well that was complete tosh so luckily I gave it a miss and got her an SEL.

    Audi and SEAT/Cupra are aligned as far as marketing and product management are concerned, likewise VW and Skoda are aligned as far as marketing and product management are concerned.

    What makes me smile a bit is Skoda owners believing that Skoda is holding up VW Group and feeding all its good ideas into VW for them to profit from, Skoda needed rescuing in the same way that SEAT needed rescuing - and SEAT was the last car manufacturer to stop using single locking systems on doors, ie no secondary locks, so something/someone needed to protect motorists from that way of designing cars!
     
  12. '& Son' managed

    '& Son' managed Third Party

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    All rather amusing considering that VAG stated that SEAT was to become their equivalent
    of Alfa Romeo when they first bought them donkeys years ago.

    - Then almost totally failed in doing that by not making them as 'good' as a VW, nor allowing
    for extra flair in the designs until recent years and always lumbering them with most un-Alfa
    type cars like the Alhambra.
    Although SEAT have been improving, they are probably still some way off from offering what
    an Alfa promises, (if sometimes not quite delivering.)

    Many have commentated over the years that VW didn't really know what to do with SEAT
    and now it seems to have come full circle.
    Seeing as SEAT's sales have proven strong in recent years and they have delivered the
    profits to go with it, you might think they should carrying-on much as they have been.
     
  13. perelaar

    perelaar Active Member

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    For what it's worth: final choice for replacing our Leon ST FR came down to Alfa Giulia Veloce or the Cupra Ateca. Cupra won in the end, because:
    - better at day to day stuff for us (bigger boot, more ground clearance - the Giulia would scrape getting in and out of parking at work)
    - better interior finish, and perceived better build quality. Not sure about that, with the recall and all. All our friends with Giulia or Stelvio had their cars recalled as well though
    - better value for money - the Alfa was just too expensive

    As for build quality: I don't think there are differences between build quality in the various VAG products. There are serious differences in material quality though. Drive around a bit in a high-end Audi and you'll know what I'm talking about. Too bad the Audis are - like Alfa - just too expensive.
     
  14. R3k1355

    R3k1355 Active Member

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    They are still the cheaper end of the VAG spectrum, but you're right Skoda have built a very strong customer base who would be pretty unimpressed if they suddenly went all Dacia on them.

    Exactly, the Seat range is alrite but if I'm brutally honest it's pretty generic and hasn't really produced anything that stands out as particularly good looking.
    In fact the Mk2 is abit of a flabby pig IMO

    On the other Hand Alfa does what Alfa does best, you cars are proper munters

    [​IMG]



    and some are utterly incredible.



    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  15. '& Son' managed

    '& Son' managed Third Party

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    ...Errr not really seeing the point about Alfa munters - the basic white 146 shown is not the
    best-looking of 146, but still more attractive than a lot of it's rivals of the time. I was happy
    enough with the, (black) one we had, the interior especially was a cut above the typical
    Escort/Astra/Golf in terms of style - and it didn't rattle or break.
     

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