DV Relcation - anyone got fitting instructions/guide?

[Feel]

Just had a look and ETKA seems to agree with you. Run the other way, boost pressure can only push the DV open when there is a pressure differential across the top (manifold vacuum) & bottom (boost) of DV in which case it's supposed to be open and it can overcome the spring preload.

If boost is supposed to go in from the side, then (a) it tells me why so many Bosch DVs fail and (b) the DV spring only needs to be as strong as the Bosch preload (as N249 duty is based on that) - my Forge green is softer than Bosch - maybe why Yellow works better?

Perhaps we should avoid the use of the word chatter as it seems to confuse with wastegate chatter which isn't what I'm talking about - DV oscillation/harshness/overshoot,etc.

I am talking about Leons though, never really looked at a standard Ibiza (although I can't see why it would be any different).

If you've ever compared the force required to push open a OE valve and a Forge one, you'll know that the OE one takes significantly more to open it (even with the yellow or even blue spring in the Forge). So it might be safe to run even stiffer.

I agree about the chatter description though - any time someone mentions a DV noise, someone else says "oooo, turbo stalling" or "wastegate chatter, that's baaaad". I think DV Oscillation.

 

[Pabs]

how do we know what the sound is? I have never heard a turbo stall or wastegate chatter - I assume my noise is the DV but how can i tell?

 

[Pabs]

what about the black liquid/gunky stuff I said I found in the old samco hose? Should this be there? I have a bit in my hose too.... worried me a bit.

I really need to try and find my boost leak around the gauge too... on my way home has a couple more "ch=ch=ch" noises again

 

[Feel]

Black gunk is just oil - always there. Perhaps clean it off to help stop pipes blowing off, but don't worry about it.

 

[Pabs]

ah cool. Thanks for that.
Just gotta sort out the leak that i seem to have around my gauge as its annoying me already. Just cant do anything til next week now

 

[Pabs]

Ok well, I will be getting in contact with forge. Today has prooved that the Cold-Side DV Relocation has made things MUCH worse in the "ch-ch-ch" department, when I accelerate hard in a gear while travelling at motorway speeds it does it quite a lot.

If anyone has any ideas in the meantime as to why this could be (I did think that a relocation was supposed to help, not hinder) I would be grateful for a reply.

In the meantime I will start a thread in the forge section to see what they say.

 

[Pabs]

ok - reversed the DV. Only had time for a very very quick blast up the road, but tested it and found it to be the same, if not worse, as the right way around.

So still no improvements here. Gonna have to dig out my forge springs and mess around til I can sort it.

Anyone else any ideas?

 

[Feel]

Check your N249 connections and what spring you have...

 

[Pabs]

spring is yellow, although probably gonna drop to the green again and see what happens.

I dont know where the n249 is, and where the connections are obviously. Is it at the front of the engine under the manifold cover bit? How do you get to it?

What should i be looking for at the N249, apart from broken/leaking pipes?


Searching on ukmkivs shows this is a VERY common problem - but i am still yet to find a solution

 

[Icecavern]

Pabs either your DV is faulty, you haven't put it back together right, or the N249 ( if that's the on that opens the DV ) sound to be faulty. Moving the DV wont make it worse, just makes the noise louder.

I assume this problem was there before the relocation?

 

[Feel]

spring is yellow, although probably gonna drop to the green again and see what happens.

I dont know where the n249 is, and where the connections are obviously. Is it at the front of the engine under the manifold cover bit? How do you get to it?

What should i be looking for at the N249, apart from broken/leaking pipes?


Searching on ukmkivs shows this is a VERY common problem - but i am still yet to find a solution

Follow the small pipe that comes out the top backwards to a "black box" bolted on the engine.

How many 'O' Rings are in your DV?

 

[m0rk]

Hmmm. I did bypass the N249 on jonah's afterwards since it was continually pulling the fault code (and dumping boost mid throttle)

 

[Pabs]

Pete. Yes problem was there before, but i noticed it happen maybe, once a month, if that. Now since relocation I notice it almost every other gear change on accelerating. MUCH worse than before.
I would also like to check - my DV is not QUIETER now its relocated, NOT louder. I checked this with a few people who have confimed as it has longer pipework for the sound to be absorbed down???? Its deinately quieter echo with my setup now (still same CAI as before)


Feel, so this is down the back end of the engine then?
I am not sure how many O rings I have - how many should I have? IIRC its either 1 or 2...

So, if I have my DV in my hand. I push the piston up compressing spring to max. I put my finger over the vacuum hole. The piston should stay PERFECTLY still? My DV piston does seem to drop slightly but not completely, and then when i let my finger off it SNAPS into its seat quick/hard.

This noise always seems to go hand-in-hand with a jolt of power, like a surge. When accelerator pedal is let off slowly. Not usually when let off quickly, although it does still happen. On ukmkiv's the threads all seem to say to use a BOV but that is in NO WAY an answer for me - it cant be the case if everyone is running recirc fine.

 

[Pabs]

AFAIK when this was happening before I had no fault codes. I havent checked since relocating the DV tho. Might try and do it tonight if possible.

Definately seems to be surging (and making mentioned noise at same time) more than it was in std position.

 

[Pabs]

ok - drive home today from work was good.

I am sure it seems to be more responsive now, but I DEFINATELY think the dv problem is worse that it was in std position. I get it on motorway when accelerating quite hard and then releasing the gas slowly. If I release the power quickly, most times its fine. Just the slow release. Seems like the DV needs a definate OPEN/CLOSE situation, not 1/2 arsed lol...

How many O rings should there be in the DV? And my explanation of the dv above, does that sound right (the test i did)

Really do appreciate your help guys. I am worried that this could be damaging things - the reading/research i have been doing says it could damage the turbo by stalling it or something, and i just want it solved. People seem to tell me not to worry, but I just dont think its right.

cheers

 

[Feel]

Valve Spring color coding
Green - 5-15 PSI
Yellow - 15-23 PSI
Blue - 23-30 PSI
Red - 30 + PSI

'O' rings, I'm fairly sure there's three, two on the piston, one for the lid. When I got mine (new but second hand if you get my drift) the one in the lid wasn't seated right.

http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/valve_service.pdf

If you've done the test and the piston stayed up, I doubt it's the valve.

I don't know, but I doubt it's the turbo stalling (I don't actually know what that sounds like though) it sounds to me like it's the DV Oscillating. If you're bothered, don't provoke it though.

If you do have your Forge off, try comparing the opening force with the stock one - it might give you some confidence to stick ANY spring in...

 

[Pabs]

I know bill runs a green spring and that he hasnt needed a stronger one. I dont have my forge off, its just easier to get to now its relocated


Really struggle to see why relocating it would make it worse! I havent changed anything on the valve or the car, just the location of the DV. I will, when I can, pull my dv apart and have a closer look. Might have to see if I can get some new O rings or something, and swap the spring.

 

[Pabs]

oh and apologies if I am going over and over the same things - its just really getting the better of me at the moment. Wanted it sorted when it was in std position, and now the problems worse it just aggrevates me even more.

 

[Feel]

New o-rings, piston and spring from Forge in a service kit.

"I havent changed anything on the valve or the car, just the location of the DV"

Well, you've changed something then! Have you checked the vacuum line?

 

[Pabs]

sorry feel - just trying to answer petes comments. Its not like I have changed the n75, n249 or the dv or dv spring. Its just moved from one side of the engine bay to the other, which is supposedly better for it. At the moment it runs much worse.

I have had the service kit sent to me in the passed. The O rings cant be much older than 6months. I just need to make sure all are seated correctly and that all 3 are present.

What should I be checking on the vacuum line? My Boost gauge still reads the same values as before, 21psi PEAK sometimes and holds at about 17psi. The hoses are all connected correctly. The hoses are all new. I had a Samco 4 piece boost hose kit, now I still have this on but the intercooler hose has the T piece in for the DV take-off. All hoses use Hi-grip jubilee clips that forge supplied and I believe are doing their job very well.