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Guide to LCR 210/225 differences

Discussion in 'Mk1 Leon Guides (1M) 2000-2006' started by Feel, Mar 7, 2007.

  1. Feel

    Feel Veedubya 'velle

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    210/225 Differences

    Exterior/Interior/Visual Differences:

    Most Customer Cupra R's were a '52 plate althought the odd ex-press car / demo maybe an '02 plate. All these cars had square mirrors (off a MkIV Golf) the later 210’s (from early May ’03 on) had teardrop mirrors.

    All 210's had black Cupra badges (the painted lettering on the rear "Cupra" badge is black). There was a limited run (total of 60 cars) of Platinum metallic paint in early '03 cars, all had teardrop mirrors.

    All 225's have teardrop mirrors, chunkier steering wheel, perforated leather on the gear knob, red cupra badges, extra stone guards on the front wheels and different wheel bearings. Platinum became standard and Artic Grey was added to the paint options. These early 225's were fitted with Tracker.

    210’s steering wheel is the same as the Cupra’s, but with red stitching. The 225 has a thicker stering wheel with a red band at the top. The steering wheels are a straight swap and the airbags are the same.

    We were never sure if the new wheel bearings were "upgrades" or just from a different supplier.

    The “pegs” holding the front carpet mats in place are round on the 210’s and oval on the 225’s.

    The parcel shelf on the 210 has retractable strings, the 225 does not.

    05 Plate 225's
    There were a few changes on the '05 (Sept 2005) cars:
    The red was changed from Flash Red to Emocion Red. Emocion red is slightly darker.
    Tracker was removed.
    Cars included a “motorsport package” - a pair of Seat Sport jackets, baseball caps and a track based tuition day.

    210’s have tape decks and 6 disc changers,
    225’s have single CD heads and 6 disc changers,
    05 reg cars have just a single CD.

    Recaros and Sat Nav where the only options, the recaro option on the 210 (£1,200) was front AND rear, on the 225s it was front only and £795.

    Very Late (When the FR+ came out) cars came in Metallic Black. The FR+ looks like a Euro Spec LCR - they are 180 petrol and 150 diesel cars, with the full LCR bodykit but with the Euro 17" LCR alloys, and no brembo calipers.

    Engine Diffrences:
    210 is an AMK Engine code, 225 is BAM.

    210bhp/199lbft vs 225ps/208lbft. Both cars remap to practically the same. The 210 is actually 212ps, and the 225(ps) is actually 222bhp.

    ECU Code for the 225 has an “A” on the end.

    There were always rumours that the 210 had stronger internals (20mm wrist pins and different rods), but it seems that this rumour stemmed from the early Audi S3 APY engine (also 210bhp) having stronger rods. However, Yumann's engine (AMK) build thread, he kindly measured the gudgeon pins for us, and they are 20mm. The later BAM engine are supposed to have 19mm wrist pins.

    From ETOS and ETKA the block and piston set for AMK :06A 103 101 J and for the BAM : 06A 103 101 J, conrod for AMK : 027 198 401 B, conrod for BAM : 027 198 401 B. So if they are different, nobody told SEAT Parts.

    Both engines have VVT, but this is apparently for emissions rather than a VTEC style torque/power shift. Although most cars definitely pull again at about 4,000 rpm). Originally we thought the VVT actuation was different (one mechanical the other hydraulic) but we now understand them to be the same. Again, it is the APY (early 210 S3 engine, never fitted to the LCR) that has mechanical VVT actuation and possibly where the rumour started. Both AMK and BAM have Electro-hydraulic VVT actuation.

    The turbo (K04-23 from Borg-Warner), manifold & exhaust are all the same.
     
    #1 Feel, Mar 7, 2007
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2007
  2. stpete

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    Few more mate! 225 has stone guard around front discs, 225 side repeaters are cheaper Seat copies of original VW with different connector. Last run of 225's came with free smartnav inc one year tracking and fifteen free routes. 6 disc changer removed on later disc equipped 225's. Both Great cars !
     
  3. sportbilly

    sportbilly thinking out loud

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    Early 225's came with a tape desk .. not sure what you do with one of those

    Which is mechanical which hydraulic ? Not that I would now how this works just interested.
     
  4. kez

    kez

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    my 03/53 225 had a tape desk.

    what did i do with it? removed it!
     
  5. browno

    browno Full Member

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    Good guide!
    My 04 plate (reg March 2004) 225 has a tape deck too... Means I can use a cassette adaptor to listen to the iPod in the car for only £3, so no complaints here...
     
  6. Mitchy

    Mitchy TTRS

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    A tape deck is highly embarrassing in a modern day hatch. It was the 1st thing i changed about the car:)

    Okay 20 years ago, but today:redface: Do they even sell tapes now:lol:

    Goos definitive guide Phil, hopefully stop the weekly threads on the matter:clap:
     
    #6 Mitchy, Mar 8, 2007
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2007
  7. Ruddmeister

    Ruddmeister Everything in Moderation

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    Gents the above is a guide not hard and fast rules

    My old 03 (July 03) plate had a single CD + 6CD and Square mirrors.

    Old stock and new stock gets registered at different times etc

    Nicely put [B)]
     
  8. Feel

    Feel Veedubya 'velle

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    Been searching, thamks to our friends in the TT and Audi world, it seems that it's the early S3 210 engine, coded APY had the mechanical VVT and 20mm gudgeon pins.

    Also, it seems the AMK and BAM have a valve that "electrically allows oil pressure from the oil pump to adjust the cam timing on the inlet camshaft". Sounds Hydraulic to me, but some people refer to it as electrical.
     
  9. RobM

    RobM Back from the dead...

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    Feel... if I understand that correctly then, the VVT actuator didn't change between the 210 and 225 engines... but it changed early on in the life of the 210 engine only? So in actual fact there were two versions of the 210 engine (APY and AMK) and it was the crossover from APY to AMK that saw the change of actuator, and not the change from AMK to BAM?

    Or have I lost the plot? :blink:
     
  10. Feel

    Feel Veedubya 'velle

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    Nope, I think you've got it spot on.

    APY was the early S3 engine (210), followed by the "Facelift" engine (there was a facelifted S3) which was the AMK, later a further engine, the BAM was introduced. There seems to be a few other differences between the APY and the later engines - it seems mostly emissions stuff, extra lambda sensors, a change from the K04-20 to the K04-23 (which is essentially the same, but has an extra sensor) and the switch from Mechanical to Hydraulic/electrical VVT actuation all related to control, and perhaps larger injectors on the AMK/BAM. It seems the ECU changed to the me7.5 on the AMK/BAM

    So, it seems there's no fundamental difference between the AMK and BAM engines :shrug:
     
  11. RobM

    RobM Back from the dead...

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    Which would then imply that the power difference comes down to one of two things... Marketing, or the ECU mapping.
     
  12. Skorchio

    Skorchio 600 Miles to a tank :)

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    Has anyone got photoes of the reat seats of a 225 and a 210 so we can see the differance?? I never knew this!!!

    Feel said:
    Recaros and Sat Nav where the only options, the recaro option on the 210 (£1,200) was front AND rear, on the 225s it was front only and £795.
     
  13. Mitchy

    Mitchy TTRS

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    Not got any pics, but they effectively make the car into a 4 seated car.

    The 2 side seats are bucket shaped seats, with side bolsters. Although you can fit an arse in between them it would be fairly uncomfy. The middle section has a fold up and down arm rest with a compartment inside.

    Far nicer than the standard seats. They only ever come on 210 model cars though.
     
  14. Skorchio

    Skorchio 600 Miles to a tank :)

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    So what comes on the 225? Standard onces??
     
  15. Mitchy

    Mitchy TTRS

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    Both 210 and 225 cars had the option of recaros however the 225 cars only ever had the option of front recaros.
    210 when ordered with recaros came front and back.
     
  16. Skorchio

    Skorchio 600 Miles to a tank :)

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    Are the rear seats in 225 still black sude ??
     
  17. RobM

    RobM Back from the dead...

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    Can this not be kept to a separate thread instead of turning this into a discussion thread? That's why the original version had to be re-created.
     
  18. Snoopie

    Snoopie Impossible

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    Already been said. Read the first post.
     
  19. Mitchy

    Mitchy TTRS

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    5 posts above this 1 asked yesterday

    Just politely answering his question for him, incase he missed it;)
     
  20. Tahiti

    Tahiti Guest

    fantastic thread - I hadn't a clue that there were so many differences!
     

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