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New K04 Hybrid, AET K04-380 - Does 402bhp on dyno

Discussion in 'Badger5' started by ibizacupra, Mar 27, 2016.

  1. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    We are happy and very pleased to share the results of our latest hybrid K04-023 unit. workign with AET Turbos a new level of performance has been reached I believe in this frame k04 unit.

    Previously, we ran an already very respectable 372bhp from another make of hybrid, in our AUM engined Lupo test car. The engine is stock AUM, with just IE rods installed. It has all supporting mods like Badger5 80mm TIP, Gen2 high flow exhaust manifold, fmic, water meth, and n/a inlet cam, with 3.5" downpipe, into 3" exhaust system.

    The turbo, with our inbuilt V2.2 Billet inlet.
    [​IMG]

    New even larger 7+7 Billet compressor wheel with ETT.
    [​IMG]

    The result (peak)
    [​IMG]

    An array of different boost levels run so far on it..
    [​IMG]

    The extremely low egt's logged during the 402bhp run - Only 840'c peak
    [​IMG]

    A superb 331bhp at only 14psi actuator pressure was a very promising start
    [​IMG]



    Prices and "Package" options will be published shortly, as AET and I discuss and finalise details. The Package will comprise of our Gen2 High Flow exhaust manifold, The Port Matched to our Gen2 manifold K04-380 turbo, and our V2.2 Billet TIP pipe. (our Gen2 manifold not available separately).


    From AET's published info, the tech spec of the turbo is as follows:
    We take a custom K16 turbine wheel a 7 deg cutback to turbine exducer to increase flow through the turbine housing.

    Before the fitment of a K24/2280 billet compressor wheels, CNC machined compressor covers to accommodate the hi-flow billet compressor wheels.

    An AET motorsport spec 360 thrust assemblies is installed to cope with increased boost pressures.
    Total seal piston rings fitted to the turbine for low back pressure exhaust systems.

    Ported wastegates for increase boost control at hiboost, and ported turbine inlet for increased air flow
    a 14psi Turbosmart IWG75 actuators fitted before being VSR Balanced to motorsport spec.

    Interested call or email for your turbo enquiries
    AET Turbos Tel: 01924 894171
    Badger5 Ltd: Tel: 01453 822880

    More Details of pricing and availability will follow shortly.

    Cheers

    Bill @badger5
     
    #1 ibizacupra, Mar 27, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2016
  2. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    Compressor and Turbine pictures...

    Explains how this power is achievable on a well setup motor.

    K16 Turbine wheel next to stock K04
    [​IMG]

    Larger 7+7 Billet compressor wheel next to stock K04
    [​IMG]
     
  3. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    A range of boost plots from Fridays testing.. No ign changes made to previous map just boost control quickly dialled in... (minimal time available to play further on it)

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Dan FR

    Dan FR Meth addict. Stage 2+ Yo!

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    Is this a one off setup or has it been run on other cars yet? Curious as to whether these numbers are a one-off or whether they would be achievable by others motors on independant dynos etc.?
     
  5. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    These results are on our test car, lupo.
    Folks need to take note, and I mean NOTE, that the turbo is spec'd and named as a K04-380 unit. Its 380bhp capable by specification. Yes we have exceeded its 380, by some 30bhp.

    What it demonstrates is in a well built system, these power figures are possible. The flip side of the coin, and boy do I see this a lot on cars coming thru here, is you Can't just throw random parts onto a car, and expect the best outcomes. Disappointment ensues. Very few folks have got a fully matched car with equal mods to get the best out of the "Package". A lot of engines I see folks having bolted hybrids and other mods to, are just plain worn out... Inevitably they just will never make as good a power level as a very healthy setup. The turbo is a single component, we're making it into an available "package" which is high flow exhaust manifold, turbo, 80mm intake, so that side of things is as good as it could be, BUT, the rest of the car also would have to be tip top.

    The fact the lupo has achieved better than "rated" power is because it is a very well matched compilation of parts, some bespoke made, and unique to the lupo, most available to buy parts which others could also do. The lupo's engine is a bog std aum. Its a low miler and clearly very good base engine. Its rodded for safety (obviously), and run an n/a inlet cam. The rest as I've take time to post many times now is as listed and as I would expect and advise anyone wanting best power from a hybrid setup to do.. Decent FMIC, decent TIP, air filter, exhaust manifold, exhaust, fuel pump, 550cc, water meth.... etc etc.. ALL STD RECOMMENDED Hybrid items I suggest to folks. The Bespoke part of the lupo is its 3.5" downpipe, which I made into its 3" exhaust system. I'm convinced it plays a significant role, with all the other mods, for allowing the turbine and hotside to deal better with back pressure... which is going to yield an efficiency gain.

    If you and others are expecting every customer install to replicate the 402bhp outcome from simply bolting this turbo onto "other" hardware, I suspect the majority wont. Its not sold as a 402bhp unit, its a 380bhp capable, where its previous hybrid was a 350bhp unit.. and indeed it did more than the 350 before, and has done more than the 380 now.. a Real Gain of 30bhp which ever way you look at it. A larger compressor is flowing more. Build the rest of the engine system to accommodate this, and it will reward.

    I have seen many cars with hybrids, and the variance in outcomes is huge.. The worst of them barely breaking past 300bhp, and the best others (Je pistoned ibiza on v4 manifold) actually beating the lupos previous 372bhp record, and several other cars getting within 10-15bhp of lupo also.

    I & others willl no doubt see a very similar variance between cars with the same turbo fitted.... No different to before on other hybrids.. The turbos are the same.. The customer cars/packages are not. Where there will inevitably be those who will struggle to make the power, and have this K04-380 package, it will not be because of the package, but the rest of their build/engine etc.

    I look forward to seeing and running more of these.... Its a big step from the previous (good) hybrid. Driving it on the road its so much faster spooling, very responsive. I like it a lot.

    Where I read of those not believing the results, despite the facts presented, I will just simply say, WE her at Badger5 BUILD cars, BUILD engines, BUILD turbo kits, and are not just a mapper with a laptop & dyno. Its always the HARDWARE which facilitates the performance. Mapping brings it all together, BUT, no one, regardless how how "good" they think they are can map a poor setup of hardware into a good result.

    Sorry for the ramble, but I think these points must be understood for those reading.

    :thumbup:
     
    #5 ibizacupra, Mar 31, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2016
    Mamic172 and vwtrev like this.
  6. Pimped up vario

    Pimped up vario Cordy Cruizer

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    Cool post. Interesting info. Is the k16 turbine the standard turbine wheel from a 2ltr cupra or 2 ltr golf r. Or is it off a lower power 2ltr 200bhp skoda octavia?
     
  7. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    PRICES: Now Released. K04-380 unit.
    Turbo prices is based on exchange basis. (non exchange +£200)
    K04-380 Turbo is £895
    Gen2 high flow manifold is £330
    V2.2 Silicon only bit of my TIP (with hose clips) is £107.50

    Prices exclude vat and Delivery
     
  8. Fozzy84

    Fozzy84 Active Member

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    Interesting!

    How much would rods cost that would accommodate this set up?
     
  9. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    Rods alone supply only are £504, big end shells to suit £55
    Supply and fit rods is £1590, includes cam belt water pump, new rings etc
     
  10. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    We have other Dyno Tests on the lupo now, Performed at JKM on their Dyno Dynamics dyno and also at Stealth Racing on their MAHA/sport_devices Dyno No change to lupo from the initial tests I have done on my own dyno. As you will notice good old Dyno Lottery applies to the figures, but relative measurements from their dynos to my own dyno show the performance from this Hybrid for what it is.. Exceptional. Comments from both Jim @ JKM and Vince @ Stealth is this is by far the most powerful K04 hybrid they have ever seen, by quite some margin. smile emoticon Tests done were actuator pressure run and on boost on. You will see quite some difference on the JKM dyno Dynamics runs, by changing just the over wishbone straps to looser, which allows some climb up the front roller. (this is their normal dyno day strapping method for the record. Uber strapped he reserves for mapping) - Have a read through JKMs Dyno Tech Description as it explains the strapping difference results compared with other Dyno dynamics dynos. http://www.jkm.org.uk/performance/dynotesting.htm

    thanks to Jim @ JKM and Vince @ Stealth Racing for their hospitality and impartiality for these tests. Both were impressed by this k04 hybrid and it has surpassed all others they have seen, by quite some margin. Well done AET.. You've made a superb turbo I think.

    Measured Results here>>

    JKM Dynoday strapped - high boost (blue plot, red plot uberstrapped 388bhp, dyno day strapped 409bhp)
    [​IMG]


    JKM Uberstrapped Actuator boost (14psi)
    [​IMG]

    Stealth Racing - MAHA/Sport_Devices Dyno, high boost
    [​IMG]


    Stealth Racing Actuator Boost
    [​IMG]

    Badger5 high and actuator, ignore the yellow plot as thats higher boost than the JKM/Stealth so not comparitive. The map/hardware on the Lupo is identical to what was run @ JKM/Stealth on the red and blue runs, all I've adjusted out is the overshoot on spool "blip" it had originally.
     
    #10 ibizacupra, Apr 21, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  11. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    neither
     
  12. Richard123

    Richard123 Rickys LCR 225

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    Hi Bill,

    Some excellent numbers from the dyno there!

    I have just ordered one of these from AET , and I have same mods as the lupo apart from N/A cam and WMI.

    What power would you expect it to make ? Just had rebuild and IE rods fitted .
     
  13. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    doubt it has same mods as lupo.. no 3.5" downpipe for example. My gen2 manifold on it?

    lack of wmi is a mystake imho if you want best results...

    compressor flow is >400bhp if your cooling and supporting mods will allow it.
    Lupo shows whats possible in well matched setup.

    mapping to be done by who?
     
  14. Richard123

    Richard123 Rickys LCR 225

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    Yeah my bad , just 3inch downpipe.
    Yeah your gen2 mani , your 80mm tip bosch 550s fmic etc
    Nick @AET suggested a company up here in Scotland to do the mapping that they have dealt with before with possibly a little assistance from you if necessary.
     
    #14 Richard123, May 4, 2016
    Last edited: May 4, 2016
  15. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    Badger5 AET/K04-380 Hybrid Turbo Package. Comprises Gen2 Chinafold, AET K04-380 turbo (exchange), Badger5 V2.2 TIP (silicon only as billet is part of turbo) - Note: Manifold is NOT available separately. £1337.50 +vat Package. Non turbo exchange price is +£200+vat

    Couple of these going onto builds so quick opportunity for a "kodak" moment.

    [​IMG]
     
  16. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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  17. Pimped up vario

    Pimped up vario Cordy Cruizer

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    Nice power delivery on this turbo on the lupo. It's starting to go the right way on terms of pick up and early torque delivery. A 2 litre striker engine would get even better lowdown response and still maintain the topend power.
     
  18. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    stroker + these style hybrids are shyte imho

    done a few now.. yes very spooly, mid range but top end strangled
    if you are stroker go bigger turbo and be done with it, unless you like diesel power delivery
     
  19. Pimped up vario

    Pimped up vario Cordy Cruizer

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    My mates tuned ALH engined mk2 golf hit 156mph at 5250 rpm or so, 30mph per thousand rpm in top, going by gps and picked up as strong from 1500rpm and full on from 2000 rpm, couldn't b bad to that.

    If this turbo made the same power at the same rpm at the top end with a stroker engine as it does with the 1.8 but with more bottom end and mid range with earlier spool then I'd be happy with that. Your turbo from I can see allows the engine to make more power and torque earlier than the Garrett series of turbos for certainly the same level of power output from the engine.

    Good job.
     
  20. ibizacupra

    ibizacupra Jack-RIP my little Friend
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    hybrid k04-02x style and stroker 20v are not a good mix imho (and actual experience of having done and seen a few)
     
    #20 ibizacupra, Jun 29, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2016

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