Which FMIC for my APR Stage + Golf??

[Ianb]

Just got rid of my Neuspeed FMIC whic as I previously knew was just too small for my new turbo installation.

Got some heat soak issues and back pressure off the old FMIC so I'm looking for something bigger and more suitable.

Looking at good fitment as I know super large cores can be awakward to fit and I am told that there is more to their efficiency than size!


Is the new Forge off the shelf going to be suitable?? They seem to be well known.

Been looking at Allard too.

I contacted Jabba and their new 'larger' Pro Alloy item has not been fitted by them as yet so they could not comment on fitment issues of this item.

Don't know whether I should go for a larger Forger core.
Bill runs an RS500 item in the Beeza.

I assume there is science in choosing the right size for maximum efficiency.?

The APR item will fit........it's very big and as a result a mother to fit

Discuss

Ian

 

[ibizacupra]

Ian, I run an RS500 sized core, not an Rs500 core.
sized against forges rs500 offering

wilko had apr fmic and replaced it when ihi'd for something bigger/better i think

 

[ForgeMotorsport]

wilko is running custom Forge

 

[Wilko]

wilko is running custom Forge

That I am.
And I need a bigger one Need to move the rad stack back to gain some depth and some height could be gained too.
My current unit is comparable to the forge cupra r unit, but my turbo is moving 50% more air than a chipped cupra r, so I think the IC is getting restrictive.

 

[Ianb]

That I am.
And I need a bigger one Need to move the rad stack back to gain some depth and some height could be gained too.
My current unit is comparable to the forge cupra r unit, but my turbo is moving 50% more air than a chipped cupra r, so I think the IC is getting restrictive.

In that case surely the new Forge iff the shelf item is not going to be big enough for my instal?

I had a quick scan ans saw GaryM's install...he's using a Forge Skoda Octavia item.............looks pretty large.

How much bigger is the Cupra R.

Allard seem to make a very nice product and is a good size.


Wilko do you get lots of issues with your current set then in everyday use? I assume your turbo is pushing alot more air than my set up then?

Forge rate their new core for modified 1.8T including bigger turbo's.

 

[DPJ]

I'm using a Cupra R FMIC and the results are promising so far.

 

[Ianb]

Cupra R item looks pretty substantial....

 

[DPJ]

I had to custom install because my layout is the same as yours. From logs so far, it's doing it's job.

 

[Wilko]

Cupra R item should be fine at 300+, but mine is a few rows shorter, and I'm running 26psi and 300g/s vs 20-21psi and 250g/s ian.

I see intake temps of 75+ on a single 4th gear pull without wi. With the wi I see 45ish.

It's not so much the temps, as the flow area (pressure drop) of the core. It means the turbo is working harder, and producing more heat.

 

[DPJ]

What are you going to fit next then, John?

 

[wild willy]

I can recommend the proalloy lcr core. Allowed my car to breath alot more readily. One thing i noticed was how much more sturdy the small cooling fins are compared to the Forge core which can be damaged during vigorous cleaning.

 

[DPJ]

I can recommend the proalloy lcr core. Allowed my car to breath alot more readily. One thing i noticed was how much more sturdy the small cooling fins are compared to the Forge core which can be damaged during vigorous cleaning.

You don't think there was too great a pressure drop for you, Carl?

 

[wild willy]

I was concerned about the pressure drop especially after Rob Don had one fitted in place of his Forge and after testing he opted to remove the Proalloy and refit the forge on grounds of pressure drop.
I've been running it for a few weeks now and am very happy with it. I think as a test i'll put my map back to stock and see if i still make stock boost levels to see what pressure drop the core makes. Personally I don't think it does have a pressure drop over the twin stock set up. I seem to have slightly lower intake temps over the forge unit, because of this i think that whatever power i may loose due to Pdrop is made up for by the power gained over reduced intake temps. If i was running 350bhp plus, this is the core I'd use.
One thing though, the Forge unit is alot easier to fit and if you factor the reworked crash bar supplied as part of the kit it also is the better value for money kit by a wee amount.

 

[DPJ]

I was concerned about the pressure drop especially after Rob Don had one fitted in place of his Forge and after testing he opted to remove the Proalloy and refit the forge on grounds of pressure drop.
I've been running it for a few weeks now and am very happy with it. I think as a test i'll put my map back to stock and see if i still make stock boost levels to see what pressure drop the core makes. Personally I don't think it does have a pressure drop over the twin stock set up. I seem to have slightly lower intake temps over the forge unit, because of this i think that whatever power i may loose due to Pdrop is made up for by the power gained over reduced intake temps. If i was running 350bhp plus, this is the core I'd use.
One thing though, the Forge unit is alot easier to fit and if you factor the reworked crash bar supplied as part of the kit it also is the better value for money kit by a wee amount.

That's interesting I didn't know Rob had put the LCR FMIC back on again.

I agree with you, if I'd been looking at 350+ I'd have gone for the ProAlloy cooler. At a guess, I don't think you should have issues with a remaped K04 (or your hybrid), but I can't see them working for a K03 turbo.

 

[Songman]

In that case surely the new Forge iff the shelf item is not going to be big enough for my instal?

I had a quick scan ans saw GaryM's install...he's using a Forge Skoda Octavia item.............looks pretty large.

How much bigger is the Cupra R.

Allard seem to make a very nice product and is a good size.


Wilko do you get lots of issues with your current set then in everyday use? I assume your turbo is pushing alot more air than my set up then?

Forge rate their new core for modified 1.8T including bigger turbo's.

I`ve used the APR FMIC on my previous Leon - it worked well, and fitted OK, with only very slight body mods.

Jabba`s IC fitted to my LCR has now done 45000miles - no probs with performnce or reliability of cooler.

 

[ibizacupra]

In that case surely the new Forge iff the shelf item is not going to be big enough for my instal?

I had a quick scan ans saw GaryM's install...he's using a Forge Skoda Octavia item.............looks pretty large.

How much bigger is the Cupra R.

Allard seem to make a very nice product and is a good size.


Wilko do you get lots of issues with your current set then in everyday use? I assume your turbo is pushing alot more air than my set up then?

Forge rate their new core for modified 1.8T including bigger turbo's.

Allards pipework is too small IMHO.

 

[ibizacupra]

I was concerned about the pressure drop especially after Rob Don had one fitted in place of his Forge and after testing he opted to remove the Proalloy and refit the forge on grounds of pressure drop.
I've been running it for a few weeks now and am very happy with it. I think as a test i'll put my map back to stock and see if i still make stock boost levels to see what pressure drop the core makes. Personally I don't think it does have a pressure drop over the twin stock set up. I seem to have slightly lower intake temps over the forge unit, because of this i think that whatever power i may loose due to Pdrop is made up for by the power gained over reduced intake temps. If i was running 350bhp plus, this is the core I'd use.
One thing though, the Forge unit is alot easier to fit and if you factor the reworked crash bar supplied as part of the kit it also is the better value for money kit by a wee amount.

how are you going to know if it has pressure loss across the core?
putting it in stock mode it will still have requested boost levels which it will achieve.. unless you know its n75 duty cycle before and after, which will give an indication (under same weather conditions) but not a p-loss figure.

remember also, p-loss is a relationship to airflow, in a ^2 relationship.
p-loss can only be meaningfully stated in relation to airflow passing thru the core at a given cfm, pressure inlet, pressure outlet... I have never seen anyone report these figures however unfortunately. (remember also, core is one part of the system itself... include pipework, diameter, length, number of bends into it, and they all contribute to losses.) Big core, nasty pipework will still give a higher p-loss. convsersely, nasty core, nice pipework can do the same thing

 

[wild willy]

how are you going to know if it has pressure loss across the core?
putting it in stock mode it will still have requested boost levels which it will achieve.. unless you know its n75 duty cycle before and after, which will give an indication (under same weather conditions) but not a p-loss figure.

remember also, p-loss is a relationship to airflow, in a ^2 relationship.
p-loss can only be meaningfully stated in relation to airflow passing thru the core at a given cfm, pressure inlet, pressure outlet... I have never seen anyone report these figures however unfortunately. (remember also, core is one part of the system itself... include pipework, diameter, length, number of bends into it, and they all contribute to losses.) Big core, nasty pipework will still give a higher p-loss. convsersely, nasty core, nice pipework can do the same thing

good point Bill, I'll have to check my logs folder and dig out a stock 118 log if i have one to compare. I was hoping boost figures at the red line may tell if boost was noticably lacking.

 

[ibizacupra]

we need to see some more physical logs of tests from all the manufacturers to make decision on their relative performances

BT, or K0x units, different airflows, and the whole system has to be tested to really know whats going on.

 

[Ianb]

Looking at various comments on here I think I will put a Forge item of some description either the Octavia/Cupra R/ Golf Cores dependant on what Forge say about their respective capabilities.

Songman; did you need to cut much of the bumper??
With the exchange rate being exceptional the APR unit's price is comparible. The only problem on the Golf is the fitment for UK cars mean lot's of cutting of the bumper.